Witchcraft Explained (21 views) Subscribe   
  From:  David (DavidABrown)    5/30/2001 8:07 am  
To:  ALL   (1 of 79)  
 
  48.1  
 
Every Cult tries to convince people that what they do is not harmful or that it is even beneficial. All magic or magick witchcraft is manipulation and it is Evil. All manipulation involves spirit forces, Witchcraft All Witchcraft is to invoke a Demonic spirit on your behalf. There is no such thing as good or white magic and bad or black magic. Manipulation remains manipulation and it is Evil. People are created by God to have a relationship with God, not to be manipulated by people and Demons.
Witchcraft, Satanism
Pharmakeia (5331) Pharmacy medicine, drug, altered state, manipulation, magic
Old Testament, Lachash (3907) whisper, mumble, cast a spell, charmer
Verses - Deut 18:10 2Kings 9:22 2Chr 33:6 Mic 5:12Nah 3:4 
First Use: Exodus 22:18 Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live. {While living in the flesh everyone has the opportunity to repent, but once physical death, then comes eternal judgment, and God will not allow a witch to remain and live in His presence} 

1Samuel 15:23 For rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft, and stubbornness is as iniquity and idolatry.

Psalm 41:7 All that hate me whisper(whisper is a form of witchcraft, spell casting) together against me: against me they do devise my hurt.

Ecclesiastes 10:20 Curse not the king, no not in thy thought, and curse not the rich in thy bedchamber: for a bird of the air (evil demonic spirit) shall carry the voice, and that which hath wings shall tell the matter.

Galatians 5:20,21 Now the works of the flesh are manifest (revealed), which are these; Adultery (unfaithfulness), fornication (uncovered), uncleanness (unmoral), lasciviousness (in contentment), idolatry (worldly desires), witchcraft (manipulation), hatred (hostility), variance (quarrel), emulations (jealousy), wrath (anger), strife (factions), seditions (disunion), heresies (unbiblical principals), envyings (ill-will), murders (ending life), drunkenness (worldly influences), revellings (letting loose), and such like: of which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

Witchcraft is the practice and art of manipulation. This is carried out as people try in selfishness to get their way, to fulfill their various desires and whims. Witchcraft is the opposite of grace, where grace is giving someone the freedom to be themselves, witchcraft is the art of using manipulations, threats, situations, even rewards, and promises as a means for manipulation, therefore placing someone in bondage and slavery to accomplish the certain desires of the manipulator. Witchcraft is a type of a spoken curse. An oath is a spoken commitment to perform a good deed, a curse is a spoken commitment to do evil and harm.

Matthew 5:37 But let your communication be, Yea (yes), yea; Nay (no), nay; for whatsoever is more (manipulation/witchcraft) than this commeth of evil. {This does not preclude conversation, debate, discussion... it means to let other people have their own convictions, dont insist on changing peoples minds}

Excerpt from the Book
Basic Christian: Theology
By David A. Brown






David A. Brown
Basic Christian: Forum
 
 
From:  Star Storm (siskama)    5/30/2001 9:54 am  
To:  David (DavidABrown)     
 
    
 
David.....I challenge you to please let your readers READ my post....Please feel free to come to my site and see if you can find anyone who HATES GOD or works to turn HIM into a Demon....Christianity takes many forms...I am a Christian/Witch...WITCH MEANS WISDOM ...pagan means Roman peasant/hillbilly..... Thank you for your time....and if by chance you delete this before it can be read, then you may be a Christian CULTIST...Look deep and see... Peace to Thee....Medicine Song 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~)0( 
Are Pagans Devil Worshippers? 
No, Pagans do not worship the Devil or Satan. Pagans do not believe in the Devil, he is part of the Judeo-Christian Religions and mythology. Most Devil worshipping groups are not Pagan, because they are centered on a Judeo-Christian supernatural being, namely Satan. These Devil Worshippers are a sect of Christianity, even though Christianity does not want to claim them. 

Their focus is on opposing the mainstream Christian God and honoring the Devil, neither of these beings are part of Paganism. There is a tradition that calls itself Satanist. Satanists are not devil worshippers. They do not believe in god or the devil or any force outside themselves and other living creatures. They believe they can control their lives without the need to place responsibility on a higher power of any kind. Devil worshippers on the other hand sometimes do claim to be Satanists. . . this leads to lots of confusion. 

People often confuse the Occult with Pagan Religion, this is a mistake, they are very different things. Many religions, including; Pagan, Non-Pagan, Christianity and Judeaism have occult aspects, many do not.. 

Are Pagans Witches? 
Some Pagans are Witches, some are not. Many Pagan groups do not practice Witchcraft. Wiccans are a type of Pagan Witches, there are also Dianic Witches, Green Witches, and other types of Pagan Witches. There are also Christian Witches, many of these people are practicing Christian, but also practice Witchcraft. Santeria is a South American religion that is a blend of VooDoo, Witchcraft and Christianity. 

What do I need to be a Pagan? 
A love of Nature, and a commitment to live in harmony with the Earth and Her creatures. You need to feel in your heart that it is where your own spirituality is leading you. Paganism is for Pagans, only you know if you are a Pagan in your heart. 

What is a Pagan Ritual? 
A Religious or Pagan Ritual is anything that focuses your spiritual energy. A church service is a ritual, so is a wedding, or a funeral, or a Hopi Sun Dance. Humans have created rituals since the beginning of time. Ritual is the way humans express their connection with divinity and each other. 

There are many kinds of Pagan Ritual, personal rituals you do by yourself, full moon rituals, by yourself or with a group. There are blessing rituals for a new home, or for children, or for healing, or cleansing. There are protection ritual, and banishing rituals, to name a few. 

Your Grandmother may have placed a horseshoe over the door, this is a popular form of simple protection ritual that is rooted in Pagan tradition. Or throwing salt over your shoulder if it is spilled, so as not to attract bad luck. 

For Wiccans and Neo-Pagans there are some basic Ritual Traditions that you may have heard about. Many Pagan Ritual begin by honoring the Earth and the 4 directions, as well as the elements the directions represent, Air, Fire, Water and Earth. A circle is cast and blessed with water, smoke, salt and light in honor of these elements. Rituals often include, singing, chanting, dancing, drumming, poetry and hymns to the Goddess or Gods. Some Rituals are very complex and are almost like a play, other rituals are very simple and flow with the energy of the group. 

Do Pagans believe in Jesus? 
Some do and some do not. Many Pagans believe in a wide variety of higher beings. Jesus is one of these beings for some Pagans. Some believe he was a great spiritual teacher, but not a god. Some have no feelings about him at all. 

Who is the Pagan God? 
There is no single Pagan God. Some Pagan faiths, like Hinduism and Eclectic Paganism have many Gods and Goddesses. Some Pagan Traditions like Taoism have no Gods or Goddesses. Some popular deities with contemporary American Pagans are Artemis-Diana, Inanna, the GreenMan, IsIs, Brigid, Rhiannon, Apollo, Kore, and Demeter. 

What is a Goddess? 
The first deities humans worshipped were Goddesses. A Goddess is the female creative and life giving forces of the Universe and much more. See "Goddess 101" for more detailed answers about what a Goddess is Goddess 101 

Do Pagans Pray? 
Yes, many Pagans pray and many connect with the divine in other ways. Many meditate as a form of prayer, other drum as a form of prayer, others chant, sing or dance. Some dedicate each task they perform during the day, to the Goddess. Throughout human history people have spoken to their Gods or Goddesses through many different kinds of "prayer". 

When a Muslim prays, they bow toward Mecca, when a Christian prays they cross themselves, when a Buddhist prays they chant or make a sand mandala, when a Pagan prays, they may be chanting, doing ritual, hugging a tree or picking up litter on a beach, as a way of connecting with their Goddesses or Gods. 

How do you become a Pagan? 
You look into your heart and ask if it is the right path for you. Some people are born Pagans, even though they do not even know the word, others are born into Pagan cultures, and many others become Pagan when they search their hearts for a connection with their Spirits. 

To become a practicing Pagan, you must learn to look at Nature and begin to honor Her ways and cycles. Many new Pagans begin by celebrating the phases of the Moon. This can be as simple as taking the time each evening to gaze at the Moon and sing softly to yourself. Make up the words as you go along, you will be amazed at how easy it is. Really look at plants, and your cat, sit quietly and see if you can feel their energy. The first steps to becoming a Pagan are becoming aware of the magic of the natural world around you. The second step is do a small personal ritual and self-blessing that celebrates your entering the Pagan Path. 






For Spell Crafting,Incense Powders, Flying Ointment,Power and Attraction Oils, Body Nourishment,Salves and various other Herbal Products, please go to Medicine Song's Majikal Moon at address below...Thank you ! Medicine Song's Majikal Moon
VERY SENSUAL SCENTED MASSAGE and BODY OILS and Crystal Point Wands etc....

Seekers of Olde Knowledge
TO DIE FOR PERFUMES & HOME SCENTS, for Body & Soul,Please visit: THE ROWAN'S PLACE 

COMMON SCENTS !


 Thanks to Dee, my Navajo Sister for the Sig Pics!!!! 
 
From:  David (DavidABrown)    5/30/2001 10:50 am  
To:  Star Storm (siskama)    (3 of 79)  
 
  48.3 in reply to 48.2  
 
The hallmark of Satanism-Witchcraft is subtlety. It is not just the obvious satanic event that is dangerous it is the subtle act.
Genesis 3:1 Now the serpent was more subtle than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yeah, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden? 

You-your groups, can choose to deny the existance of Satan in the world, and you can also choose to deny the existance of Jesus as God, but it only reveals that you have neglected reality.




David A. Brown
Basic Christian: Forum




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Edited 5/30/01 1:52:42 PM ET by DAVIDABROWN 
  
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  From:  Star Storm (siskama)    5/30/2001 11:00 am  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (4 of 79)  
 
  48.4 in reply to 48.3  
 
I see that you did NOT READ what I said about MYSELF David.....I am a CHRISTIAN who loves Jesus with all my heart....While you are a Narrow-minded Cultist with Blinders on where anyone else's beliefs are concerned....There is no hope for you because you have TOO MUCH self pride to get through the Eye of That needle that the Bible talks about.....YOU and yours probably would at this time say it is your CHRISTIAN DUTY to BURN people at the Stake who do not see the way you do.....TSK TSK TSK...it is a sin as well to hate your neighbor....Look up the Commandments Dave...You are a FUNDIE they are ANATHEMA to the real Christian population! Take care and DO NOT EXCUSE MY Signature pics and words..... Medicine Song



For Spell Crafting,Incense Powders, Flying Ointment,Power and Attraction Oils, Body Nourishment,Salves and various other Herbal Products, please go to Medicine Song's Majikal Moon at address below...Thank you ! Medicine Song's Majikal Moon
VERY SENSUAL SCENTED MASSAGE and BODY OILS and Crystal Point Wands etc....

Seekers of Olde Knowledge
TO DIE FOR PERFUMES & HOME SCENTS, for Body & Soul,Please visit: THE ROWAN'S PLACE 

COMMON SCENTS !


 
 
  
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  From:  Star Storm (siskama)    5/30/2001 11:09 am  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (5 of 79)  
 
  48.5 in reply to 48.3  
 
Well shoot! Besides that WHAT in the WORLD does the Quote from Genesis have to do with Witch Craft???? Or could it be, that like MOST Fundies YOU HATE Women and couldnt think of anything more FITTING???? 



For Spell Crafting,Incense Powders, Flying Ointment,Power and Attraction Oils, Body Nourishment,Salves and various other Herbal Products, please go to Medicine Song's Majikal Moon at address below...Thank you ! Medicine Song's Majikal Moon
VERY SENSUAL SCENTED MASSAGE and BODY OILS and Crystal Point Wands etc....

Seekers of Olde Knowledge
TO DIE FOR PERFUMES & HOME SCENTS, for Body & Soul,Please visit: THE ROWAN'S PLACE 

COMMON SCENTS !


 
 
  
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  From:  David (DavidABrown)    5/30/2001 11:21 am  
To:  Star Storm (siskama)    (6 of 79)  
 
  48.6 in reply to 48.5  
 
Yes, I did read what you had to say. 
*This is a quote from you from the string Pagans, Atheists & Cults please read 

<Hi Jade....You are very welcome to come over to Seekers....we are some of us Christain/Witches and WE KNOW we dont even believe in the Satan that the Judeo-Christians thought up.....THERE IS NO SATAN...If you do wrong its cause YOU DID WRONG!!!! Plain and simple....Peace to thee Jade....Medicine Song> 

You seem to have no problem stereotyping and labeling me. I have never advocated and never would, burning people at the stake. 

You can engage in calm discussion here if you choose to leave the slander and innuendo, wich is so easily used instead of reason and information. 






David A. Brown
Basic Christian: Forum
 
  
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  From:  Star Storm (siskama)    5/30/2001 11:28 am  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (7 of 79)  
 
  48.7 in reply to 48.6  
 
David....You yourself have used SLANDER and Innuendo if you choose to call it that, by calling Me and other Christian Witches names and saying how sinfilled we are....You choose to see only what you have hear as GOSPEL concering myself and others like myself who would never ever harm another....YOUR satan harms and you believe that...I believe that Satan does not exist...that evilness grows in the hearts of people not taught Gentleness and kindness and to live like Jesus did...I do not believe every word of ANYONES Bible, man's hand has ill-written and Ill-transcribed many many scrolls etc....I wont trouble you again....But remember this : Jesus walked with prostitutes and lepers....Would you? I would, to help them.... Medicine Song



For Spell Crafting,Incense Powders, Flying Ointment,Power and Attraction Oils, Body Nourishment,Salves and various other Herbal Products, please go to Medicine Song's Majikal Moon at address below...Thank you ! Medicine Song's Majikal Moon
VERY SENSUAL SCENTED MASSAGE and BODY OILS and Crystal Point Wands etc....

Seekers of Olde Knowledge
TO DIE FOR PERFUMES & HOME SCENTS, for Body & Soul,Please visit: THE ROWAN'S PLACE 

COMMON SCENTS !


 
 
  
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  From:  David (DavidABrown)    5/30/2001 11:39 am  
To:  Star Storm (siskama)    (8 of 79)  
 
  48.8 in reply to 48.7  
 
Yes.
Jesus walked with prostitutes and all sinners, to encourage them and to show them the way to Himself and True Life.


I thank you for your posts and I Apologize for any statement that was out of line towards you. 

May God richly Bless you and keep you! 






David A. Brown
Basic Christian: Forum




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Edited 5/30/01 2:47:10 PM ET by DAVIDABROWN 
  
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  From:  Star Storm (siskama)    5/30/2001 12:08 pm  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (9 of 79)  
 
  48.9 in reply to 48.8  
 
And Blessings manyfold to thee..... MS



For Spell Crafting,Incense Powders, Flying Ointment,Power and Attraction Oils, Body Nourishment,Salves and various other Herbal Products, please go to Medicine Song's Majikal Moon at address below...Thank you ! Medicine Song's Majikal Moon
VERY SENSUAL SCENTED MASSAGE and BODY OILS and Crystal Point Wands etc....

Seekers of Olde Knowledge
TO DIE FOR PERFUMES & HOME SCENTS, for Body & Soul,Please visit: THE ROWAN'S PLACE 

COMMON SCENTS !


 
 
  
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  From:  Anne Athema (aathema)   5/30/2001 1:40 pm  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (10 of 79)  
 
  48.10 in reply to 48.1  
 
It's funny when a professed Christian takes it upon himself to "explain" another belief system. Unfortunately, you are sadly misinformed. I find your use of Bible quotes to villify witchcraft problematic. How can one religion define another? You take your information from your own religion, which is by definition biased, rather than actually taking an objective look at witchcraft. If one really wants to know about a group of people who are different than one, one should go to that group and ask them. A good place to start is http://www.---.com. There are a number of other reputable sites out there that can explain the basics of witchcraft without all the misinformation. 
I encourage everyone to ask their own questions and come to their own conclusions, rather than blindly following this kind of propaganda. 
 People With SupaPowas! 

image copyright 1998-2000, Serena Valentino & Ted Naifeh 

Edited 5/30/01 4:43:20 PM ET by AATHEMA 



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Edited 5/30/01 4:53:10 PM ET by DAVIDABROWN 
  
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  From:  Star Storm (siskama)    5/31/2001 9:56 am  
To:  Anne Athema (aathema)   (11 of 79)  
 
  48.11 in reply to 48.10  
 
Way to Go Anne!!!! )0( MS



For Spell Crafting,Incense Powders, Flying Ointment,Power and Attraction Oils, Body Nourishment,Salves and various other Herbal Products, please go to Medicine Song's Majikal Moon at address below...Thank you ! Medicine Song's Majikal Moon
VERY SENSUAL SCENTED MASSAGE and BODY OILS and Crystal Point Wands etc....

Seekers of Olde Knowledge
TO DIE FOR PERFUMES & HOME SCENTS, for Body & Soul,Please visit: THE ROWAN'S PLACE 

COMMON SCENTS !


 
 
  
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  From:  Anne Athema (aathema)   5/31/2001 3:10 pm  
To:  Star Storm (siskama)    (12 of 79)  
 
  48.12 in reply to 48.11  
 
Thanks. Cool site. I'm really interested in herbs (and even have a forum devoted to herbalism--but it's pretty dead right now), so I'll probably be dropping Seekers of Olde Knowledge a lot.

 People With SupaPowas! 


image copyright 1998-2000, Serena Valentino & Ted Naifeh
 
  
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  From:  Star Storm (siskama)    5/31/2001 5:42 pm  
To:  Anne Athema (aathema)   (13 of 79)  
 
  48.13 in reply to 48.12  
 
My great and Wonderful Shaman Buddy Hombre Verde has an Herb chat there tonight ....Please drop by! Thanks ...MS


For Spell Crafting,Incense Powders, Flying Ointment,Power and Attraction Oils, Body Nourishment,Salves and various other Herbal Products, please go to Medicine Song's Majikal Moon at address below...Thank you ! Medicine Song's Majikal Moon
VERY SENSUAL SCENTED MASSAGE and BODY OILS and Crystal Point Wands etc....
Seekers of Olde Knowledge
TO DIE FOR PERFUMES & HOME SCENTS, for Body & Soul,Please visit: THE ROWAN'S PLACE 

COMMON SCENTS !


  
 
  
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  From:  Zebra30   6/1/2001 4:20 am  
To:  Star Storm (siskama)    (14 of 79)  
 
  48.14 in reply to 48.7  
 
Aren't you a little confused, Medicine Song? You say that you are a Christian witch. Don't you realize that {true} Christianity is incompatible with witchcraft and other works of darkness? And whether you want to believe it or not, Satan (the Devil) does exist and he after your soul and mine. By the way, what is a "fundie" exactly (which is what you called David)? 
  
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  From:  David (DavidABrown)    6/1/2001 7:32 am  
To:  Star Storm (siskama)    (15 of 79)  
 
  48.15 in reply to 48.7  
 
Medicine Song 
I too would also like to know why you chose to call me a fundie and just what it means. 

I have heard that the remark originates from the Harry Potter books and that it is a slander for anyone who does not believe your way. 

From what I understand it is a derogatory  racist type of remark. 

If this is true, this is a very intolerant remark on your part and it is a Shame that you represent yourself and your beliefs in this manner. 

I hope you will have an explanation or perhaps an apology for using such a word. 





David A. Brown
Basic Christian: Forum
 
  
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  From:  Star Storm (siskama)    6/1/2001 8:00 am  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (16 of 79)  
 
  48.16 in reply to 48.15  
 
Dave and Zebra.....Pardon me but your inability to read and Comprehend is showing....A Fundie is a FUNDAMENTALIST Christian who is way over the edge with their intolerances to anyone elses beliefs, so much so that they have become that dreaded 'CULTISH Christian'......and if either of you had BOTHERED to read the post that describes WHAT I AM....you would see that I DO NOT and NEVER HAVE or never WILL Do anything HURTFUL BECAUSE of my beliefs.... 
# 1 PAGAN MEANS A PERSON WHO LOVES AND BELIEVES IN THE LIFE ALL AROUND US....THINGS THAT GOD MADE 
#2...WITCH COMES FROM A VERY FAR PAST CELTIC WORD MEANING WISE PERSON (WISE PERSON BEING SOMEONE WHO KNEW HOW TO HEAL AND CURE WITH THE PLANTS THAT GOD MADE)...... 
GET off your lazy butts and research something.....Harry Potter is a FICTION BOOK that children are reading in DROVES!!!! It gets them to read.....The Fundies of the world have not been able to do that with their horrific threats of eternal damnation......and as for MANIPULATION, that is what you all do when you try to convince some poor sap that I am EVIL....I am a much better Christian than either of you: I am TOLERANT of others beliefs and the only manipulations I do are to heal and drive out illnesses with herbs and prayers to the EARTH MOTHER (you call her MARY) and Father Sky (you call Him God)....YOU LIE outright when you say that my world is one of Evil.....Evil lies in your hearts to make you go and Crucify people who do not go as dumb cattle in your wake..... I have said all that is neccesary....You will not read and understand any truth but your own...so....I hope your God (old testament one) has saved a space for intolerant, cold blooded, truth twisters....otherwise you arent gonna make the cut....PS I know you will never study up before you start calling people terrible things so I will leave you with this....IF I were to cast a bad spell over you, it would come back to me times x's 3-9 you are most certainly NOT WORTH That! Have a great Friday and Blessed be to you all.....Medicine Song...Native American Shaman and Christian/ Celtic Witch.. )O(

 
For Spell Crafting,Incense Powders, Flying Ointment,Power and Attraction Oils, Body Nourishment,Salves and various other Herbal Products, please go to Medicine Song's Majikal Moon at address below...Thank you ! Medicine Song's Majikal Moon
VERY SENSUAL SCENTED MASSAGE and BODY OILS and Crystal Point Wands etc....
Seekers of Olde Knowledge
TO DIE FOR PERFUMES & HOME SCENTS, for Body & Soul,Please visit: THE ROWAN'S PLACE 

COMMON SCENTS !


  
 
  
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  From:  David (DavidABrown)    6/1/2001 8:16 am  
To:  Star Storm (siskama)    (17 of 79)  
 
  48.17 in reply to 48.16  
 
Everyone can tell by all of the SHOUTING that you do in your posts that you are a calm person.



David A. Brown
Basic Christian: Forum
 
  
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  From:  Star Storm (siskama)    6/1/2001 8:44 am  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (18 of 79)  
 
  48.18 in reply to 48.17  
 
As a Newspaper Journalist....On paper you use caps for EMPHASIS.....If you think thats shouting ... sorry, you are not important enough for me to shout at....The caps are merely to call attention to certain words.....Your arguments are so frail against what I have said that you have that pitiful excuse to get back at me? You are slipping Dave....You could have AT LEAST found some trumped up argument against all that I have told you...Instead, and since I am not all vitriolic.. you can only pitifully accuse me of shouting......Geeze, I expected more from ya Dave...your ignorance about who and what I am is showing....See, I am a Christian, and a better one than thou.... I dont have to call you names and denounce your beliefs.... Heck it isnt fun to discuss something with people too silly to do their own research..... Later Dave....Got a spell to go do....Eye of frog and hair of bat, ya know? hahahahahahahahahahahahahahah Watch out for those Cauldrons Dave, they will suck you right in! :) MS

 
For Spell Crafting,Incense Powders, Flying Ointment,Power and Attraction Oils, Body Nourishment,Salves and various other Herbal Products, please go to Medicine Song's Majikal Moon at address below...Thank you ! Medicine Song's Majikal Moon
VERY SENSUAL SCENTED MASSAGE and BODY OILS and Crystal Point Wands etc....
Seekers of Olde Knowledge
TO DIE FOR PERFUMES & HOME SCENTS, for Body & Soul,Please visit: THE ROWAN'S PLACE 

COMMON SCENTS !


  
 
  
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  From:  Rowan (POTIONS)    6/1/2001 6:02 pm  
To:  Zebra30   (19 of 79)  
 
  48.19 in reply to 48.14  
 
After reading all these posts with interest, I have decided you ask a valid question. 
The term "fundie" began in the 70's shortly after the "Born Again' movement was started. It was a term used BY those who were "Born Again" to define themselves as Fundamental Christians who wished to follow the teachings of Jesus as related in the pages of the Bible. Sadly, They failed to follow the most important of these, tolerance. 

As used in the Harry Potter Books, it is a term used to define all those non-majikal. Sort of like being called caucasian or non-caucasion? Not slanderous, but perhaps as judgemental? 

So many humans are preaching intolerance of others beliefs that this world has been a mess since the Holy Roman Empire and we seem to just keep continuing the evil that MAN does. We cannot hold responsible a GOD or Anti God [Satan]that gives you free will to make a choice to do evil. Every one has a choice and to blame it on "the devil" or ANYONE else instead of accepting responsibility for the poor choices we make is down right ludicrous. It's too bad we all can't choose to mind our OWN behaviors and let ourselves grow? We, as a species, are a nosey bunch. But instead of taking what others believe as a learning experience and putting the knowledge to use for better understanding and peace, we seem to ALL be of the opinion that we each know what's best for the world. 

SIGH 

It's too bad that the "Perfect World" envisioned by most of the world's religeons and their "Off shoots /sects /cults" just can't grow up and get along. It is OK to agree to disagree and find a common ground for living together. Why should businesses and some nations be smarter than the individuals living in them? 

Please note, that I did not try to teach anyone about any particular religeon here, nor did I put down any individuals. Religeon and politics ALWAYS cause arguments because those in the discussion are deaf to the veiwpoints of each other. Isn't that a sad comment on humanity? It is also the reason that those of us who do not follow conventional religeons, do not have the option of being open with our beliefs. We are treated just as badly by the "upstanding citizens" of our communities as are both Jews [ the chosen people] and Gays. While I understand that fear is a powerful motivator, I do not like knowing that there are people in this world who proport to follow the teachings of a pacifist and yet go out to harm others. [ this occurs in many formal religeons - more wars have been fought in the name of GOD than for any other reason] 

I say, if it makes you a better person and allows you to be kind and loving to others, it is working and don't fix what isn't broken. 

Since you do NOT know me as a person, I ask you to please NOT judge me or lump me in with any generalizations which have been taught to you. I continue to study all religeons and find most of them have a common thread which could be the basis for humans to get along..... if only others would listen? 

Walk in the light 


Contemplate the little things in life and then enjoy them all!..... Rowan





Many thanks to Valcali at Creative Signatures, who took my dream and made it real! 


Creative Signatures


For wonderful herbal products, please go to:


Medicine Song's Moon Lair

For you perfume or aroma items, please visit me at:


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   From:  janlcc   6/1/2001 7:49 pm  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (20 of 79)  
 
  48.20 in reply to 48.15  
 
There is no such term, either directly or by inference, in the Harry Potter books. Perhaps you should try reading them! 
  
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From:  janlcc   6/1/2001 7:53 pm  
To:  Rowan (POTIONS)    (21 of 79)  
 
  48.21 in reply to 48.19  
 
"Muggles" are non-magical in the Rowling books. No fundies. Poor Harry. 
  
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  From:  Rowan (POTIONS)    6/1/2001 8:17 pm  
To:  janlcc   (22 of 79)  
 
  48.22 in reply to 48.21  
 
Thank You for the info, I do stand corrected.

Contemplate the little things in life and then enjoy them all!..... Rowan





Many thanks to Valcali at Creative Signatures, who took my dream and made it real! 


Creative Signatures


For wonderful herbal products, please go to:


Medicine Song's Moon Lair

For you perfume or aroma items, please visit me at:


Common Scents Perfumes

 
  
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  From:  louderpleez1   6/3/2001 9:00 am  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (23 of 79)  
 
  48.23 in reply to 48.1  
 
Do you really believe in this stuff?! Because I sure don't and therefore it does not exist in my "HEART," "MIND," OR "MOUTH." Take care and may god bless you all always. O:-}

http://headbangersue.knac.com PURE ROCK PATROL 
  
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  From:  Hombre Verde (HOMBREVERDE)   6/4/2001 8:04 pm  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (24 of 79)  
 
  48.24 in reply to 48.1  
 
David my friend I am sorry to say you are sadly mis-informed as to what constitutes a witch. Not to mention basing your very first arguement [First Use: Exodus 22:18 Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live. {While living in the flesh everyone has the opportunity to repent, but once physical death, then comes eternal judgment, and God will not allow a witch to remain and live in His presence} ] on a mis-translation from the hebrew in the King James Bible...the true quote is "Thou shalt not suffer a POISONER (aka assassin) to live" 
Witchcraft it an absolutely nature oriented religion...we who call ourselves witches, and YES I am a witch too (the phrase Warlock for a male witch is an insulting term that means "oathbreaker"), prefer to see the duality of both female and male energy or "animas" and "anima" 
it all creation. 

Also we choose to avoid the conflict of claiming there is only one diety then dividing the same diety into 3 parts and worshiping them individually hence making three dieties out of the one. 

Nor do we worship the devil as that being is a creation of the Christian Church (read the Torah in it's original hebrew and you will find that there is no "Devil" yes the snake in Genesis tempts Eve into tasting the fruit od knowledge...but no where is that entity responsible for a fiery pit of brimstone into which "sinners" are cast. 

As for the practice of Heresy. Who should know more about heresy then one whose religious leaders were cast out of their original religion for that very fact. If one takes the teachings of the Old and the New Testaments as truth (despite the constant inaccuracies and obvious contradictions within them both) then the original Christians, and all the sub sects (catholics, Lutherans, Presbeterians, Mormans, Baptists, etc.) were all heretics who were in turn cast out of their primary religions, and in some instances from their secondary ones as well. 

To paraphrase a quote from YOUR bible: Let he who is without fault cast the first stone. 








"Ask the Green Man where he comes from... Ask the cup that fills with red...
Ask the old grey standing stones who show the sun his way to bed...
Question all as to their ways, and learn the secrets that they hold...
Walk the lines of Nature's palm, crossed with Silver and with Gold..."


~verse from Jethro Tull's "Cup of Wonder" 


VISIT MY HOMEPAGE


Do not under any circumstances click here!

 
  
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  From:  Star Storm (siskama)    6/4/2001 8:35 pm  
To:  Hombre Verde (HOMBREVERDE)   (25 of 79)  
 
  48.25 in reply to 48.24  
 
Hail and well met my Friend Green Man......You are well read in the Doctrines of Christianity, as are most of us at whom those stones are being cast....We cannot be hurt by sticks and stones though....so hahahahahahhaha!!! David and the Extreme Right

 
For Spell Crafting,Incense Powders, Flying Ointment,Power and Attraction Oils, Body Nourishment,Salves and various other Herbal Products, please go to Medicine Song's Majikal Moon at address below...Thank you ! Medicine Song's Majikal Moon
VERY SENSUAL SCENTED MASSAGE and BODY OILS and Crystal Point Wands etc....
Seekers of Olde Knowledge
TO DIE FOR PERFUMES & HOME SCENTS, for Body & Soul,Please visit: THE ROWAN'S PLACE 

COMMON SCENTS !


 
 
  
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  From:  Hombre Verde (HOMBREVERDE)   6/5/2001 8:21 pm  
To:  Star Storm (siskama)    (26 of 79)  
 
  48.26 in reply to 48.25  
 
Bright Blessings to you to Medicine Sister. 
I never thought those courses I took in comparative religions back in high school would come in handy...but it looks like they finally did. 

I wonder if we should post a few notes in here (documented with photos as well) of not only the Pagan origins of the Majority of the Christian Holidays (I would include the Jewish ones too...but since the quaballah is the base for quite a bit of ceremonial magick I truely am not sure who borrowed from who) along with the fact that in many European Churches several of the pagan images are blatantly displayed (such as my namesake the Greenman)? Or do you feel our anal retentive friend here would feel that the images were falsified??







"Ask the Green Man where he comes from... Ask the cup that fills with red...
Ask the old grey standing stones who show the sun his way to bed...
Question all as to their ways, and learn the secrets that they hold...
Walk the lines of Nature's palm, crossed with Silver and with Gold..."


~verse from Jethro Tull's "Cup of Wonder" 


VISIT MY HOMEPAGE


Do not under any circumstances click here!

 
  
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  From:  David (DavidABrown)    6/5/2001 8:38 pm  
To:  Hombre Verde (HOMBREVERDE)   (27 of 79)  
 
  48.27 in reply to 48.26  
 
Feel free to post anything you would like to. 
I do ask that you refrain from the offensive language while on this forum. If anyone made the comment to you that you made to me in the above post I dont think you would appreciate it. 

If you would like to discuss the Christian biblical Holidays please read the post A walk with Jesus 2,000 years ago I have already posted some on that topic. 





David A. Brown
Basic Christian: Forum
 
  
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  From:  Star Storm (siskama)    6/5/2001 9:31 pm  
To:  Hombre Verde (HOMBREVERDE)   (28 of 79)  
 
  48.28 in reply to 48.24  
 
Wulll YUP!!!! Post on CHRIST- mass ~~~~ YULE 
Easter~~~~ OESTARA........Yeah ya might better.....Love ya lots brother greenman! xoxo MS

 
For Spell Crafting,Incense Powders, Flying Ointment,Power and Attraction Oils, Body Nourishment,Salves and various other Herbal Products, please go to Medicine Song's Majikal Moon at address below...Thank you ! Medicine Song's Majikal Moon
VERY SENSUAL SCENTED MASSAGE and BODY OILS and Crystal Point Wands etc....
Seekers of Olde Knowledge
TO DIE FOR PERFUMES & HOME SCENTS, for Body & Soul,Please visit: THE ROWAN'S PLACE 

COMMON SCENTS !


 
 
  
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  From:  Will (xv1100a)   6/10/2001 12:18 pm  
To:  Hombre Verde (HOMBREVERDE)   (29 of 79)  
 
  48.29 in reply to 48.24  
 
**on a mis-translation from the hebrew in the King James 
Bible...the true quote is "Thou shalt not suffer a POISONER (aka assassin) to live"** 
You are trusting fallicy created by people that want to be a Witch, but don't want to be 'evil'. If you boyther to read the other passages around that one, you see that it is a blanket condemnation of ALL that use Magick, spells, spirits or divination. (unless you have redfined all those words too...)


Freedom- the state of being without restraint. 
"They that can give up essential liberty to gain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." 
- Benjamin Franklin

Will 

First Officer
Southern Cruisers Riding Club
SunCoast Chapter 

Southern

Pride 
 
  
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  From:  Hombre Verde (HOMBREVERDE)   6/10/2001 3:37 pm  
To:  Will (xv1100a)   (30 of 79)  
 
  48.30 in reply to 48.29  
 
>>You are trusting fallicy created by people that want to be a Witch, but don't want to be 'evil'. If you boyther to read the other passages around that one, you see that it is a blanket condemnation of ALL that use Magick, spells, spirits or divination. (unless you have redfined all those words too...)<< 
On the contrary my friend, I am basing my translation on the fact that I attended Hebrew School from age 5 to age 18, as well as further studying both Hebrew and Aramaic while in College, and a course in Humanities as preparation for the clergy. 

In light of my studies, which include both the Talmud and the Quaballah (sometimes spelled Kaballah) I can state that in Judiac teachings, Ritual Magic was often applied, such as in the case fo the Seven Seals of Solomon (which by the way is also used in the Islamic teachings) 

Further more, if you can read German, if youread a copy of the Guttenburg Bible (a printing that predates King James you will find the translation form the Hebrew to read Poisoners as well) However rather than take my or anyone elses word for this...I suggest that you simply talk to a Rabbi from a synagogue near your home and if you hammen to have an Islamic temple near by talk to the Iman there as well.







"Ask the Green Man where he comes from... Ask the cup that fills with red...
Ask the old grey standing stones who show the sun his way to bed...
Question all as to their ways, and learn the secrets that they hold...
Walk the lines of Nature's palm, crossed with Silver and with Gold..."


~verse from Jethro Tull's "Cup of Wonder" 


VISIT MY HOMEPAGE


Do not under any circumstances click here!

 
  
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  From:  Dr_Shock   6/12/2001 3:28 am  
To:  Hombre Verde (HOMBREVERDE)   (31 of 79)  
 
  48.31 in reply to 48.30  
 
With the Guttenberg Bible thing... 
Now, I read German better than I write it, speak it or spell it (although I still suck at reading it). However, I have to disaguree with you on the words which any modern copy of a Guttenberg Bible contain. I'm a rare book collector concentraiting on religious and magical texts and the first thing I learned was that any modern copy of an old work is usually tampered with. For example, modern copies of Crowley's work severely differ from 1st printings of the same thing (hence why all the Crowley I own is in 1st ed.) In other words, you'd have to get yourself and original Guttenberg to get the real deal. Unfortunately, I've never had the six+ grand to do that... 

Just something to think about.


-The Mad Dr. Shock
 
  
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  From:  Hombre Verde (HOMBREVERDE)   6/12/2001 6:13 pm  
To:  Dr_Shock   (32 of 79)  
 
  48.32 in reply to 48.31  
 
Greetings and well met Dr Shock 
You at least pose a sensible arguement, While it is true that later editions of books sometimes have revisions in them, I have never in my studies found one where the text was altered in any maner other than to correct grammer, or in some way explain archaic phrases through annotation ... this is not to say that what you say about translations being altered does not hold true...just that in my 45 years of life I have yet to find any major book that has beed altered in a manner that changes the entire meaning of the text. In regards to the copy of the Guttenberg Bible I had a chance to read, It belonged to the late stepfather of my ex, and was a family heirloom passed down through approximately 350 years based on the birth/death records of his family that were recorded in the "family tree" pages. 









"Ask the Green Man where he comes from... Ask the cup that fills with red...
Ask the old grey standing stones who show the sun his way to bed...
Question all as to their ways, and learn the secrets that they hold...
Walk the lines of Nature's palm, crossed with Silver and with Gold..."


~verse from Jethro Tull's "Cup of Wonder" 


VISIT MY HOMEPAGE


Do not under any circumstances click here!

 
  
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  From:  Will (xv1100a)   6/13/2001 3:07 pm  
To:  Hombre Verde (HOMBREVERDE) unread  (33 of 79)  
 
  48.33 in reply to 48.30  
 
So you say that there is nothing against Evocation, Divination & having 'familair spirits'? would you be so kind as to 'translate' what those passages ARE against then? 
The thing is I HAVE spoken with a Rabbi, who assured me that the word in the Law was indeed a 'mumbler of spells'. Those Muslims I have spoken to assure me that ALL 'Magic' is of Shaitan, & NOT to be dealt with. 

Alas! I do not speak German, not possess a copy of the Gutenburg Bible! 

I am willing to admit that I could be wrong, (been wrong before) however, request information about the OTHER passages concerning Magick first.


Freedom- the state of being without restraint. 
"They that can give up essential liberty to gain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." 
- Benjamin Franklin

Will 

First Officer
Southern Cruisers Riding Club
SunCoast Chapter 

Southern

Pride 
 
  
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  From:  Bob Blaylock (Bob_Blaylock)   6/13/2001 3:39 pm  
To:  Will (xv1100a)   (34 of 79)  
 
  48.34 in reply to 48.33  
 
Will (XV1100A) wrote:So you say that there is nothing against Evocation, Divination & having 'familair spirits'? would you be so kind as to 'translate' what those passages ARE against then?

The thing is I HAVE spoken with a Rabbi, who assured me that the word in the Law was indeed a 'mumbler of spells'. Those Muslims I have spoken to assure me that ALL 'Magic' is of Shaitan, & NOT to be dealt with.
  I note that in the KJV Bible, Isaiah 8:19 uses the phrase, wizards that peep, and that mutter.  I understand, in this context, the word peep to refer to peeping into some object, such as a crystal ball, and pretending, by supernatural power, to see things therein.  I had understood mutter in this context to refer to speaking of gibberish, but perhaps it could very easily refer, as you say, to a mumbler of spells.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 To email me, remove the string .nospam from the email address which appears below.  DO NOT send me any form of advertising, chain letters, or other such garbage.  Spammers will be dealt with very harshly!

bob-blaylock.nospam@usa.net  

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Edited 7/10/2001 9:04:40 PM ET by DAVIDABROWN 
  
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  From:  Dr_Shock   6/13/2001 4:00 pm  
To:  Hombre Verde (HOMBREVERDE) unread  (35 of 79)  
 
  48.35 in reply to 48.32  
 
The post I made wasn't so much geered towards you as it was others. It was more of a "buyer beware" statement than much else. Usually only books which have had bitter fights over copywrite end up having major changes made to them. (I should have said that before in my post. Stupid me.) 
Heck. You've gotten to read an original Guttenberg, lucky punk!


-The Mad Dr. Shock
 
  
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  From:  DW (DeathWish123)   6/13/2001 4:10 pm  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (36 of 79)  
 
  48.36 in reply to 48.1  
 
Did Jesus not say "Even pagans sit at thy Father's table."?

---------------------------------- 

W.W.I.D 

What would I do?  
  
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  From:  David (DavidABrown)    6/13/2001 5:06 pm  
To:  DW (DeathWish123)   (37 of 79)  
 
  48.37 in reply to 48.36  
 
Not familure with anything you are trying to refrence. 
Jesus said that He came to save sinners. 

The Bible is clear No Pagans in Heaven (God's Kingdom).




David A. Brown
Basic Christian: Forum
 
  
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  From:  M_DAuvergne   6/15/2001 7:13 pm  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (38 of 79)  
 
  48.38 in reply to 48.1  
 
Umm...I believe that "witchcraft" is loving the earth and nature around us, drawing energy and happines from it, and giving back to the earth. Since the earth is solid, and visible, I think it makes more sense than much else in this world.

Je te remercie! 
~M. D'Auvergne
 
  
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  From:  Will (xv1100a)   6/17/2001 7:46 am  
To:  DW (DeathWish123)   (39 of 79)  
 
  48.39 in reply to 48.36  
 
I sincerly doubt it! Since at that time the only meaning of 'Pagan' would be the Latin root meaning 'rural dweller'. However, by the time the Bible was compiled, it had come to be an insult hurled at those that didn't embrace the NEW Religion. 
Sort of like calling someone a "ignorant hick"... 


Freedom- the state of being without restraint. 
"They that can give up essential liberty to gain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." 
- Benjamin Franklin

Will 

First Officer
Southern Cruisers Riding Club
SunCoast Chapter 

Southern

Pride 
 
  
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   From:  David (DavidABrown)    6/26/2001 12:04 pm  
To:  ALL   (40 of 79)  
 
  48.40 in reply to 48.1  
 
Here are some Links to explain Witchcraft. 
www.chick.com/reading/books/179/179intro.asp 

www.chick.com/bc/1999/wicca.asp 

www.trustthebible.com/astrology.htm 

http://farsinet.com/truth/index1.html 

www.geocities.com/athens/7734/witch1.htm 





David A. Brown
Basic Christian: Forum
 
  
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From:  Al Kupone (Kupone)   6/26/2001 4:13 pm  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (41 of 79)  
 
  48.41 in reply to 48.40  
 
Chick Tracts for part of your defense of your argument? Have you actually read those. The Death Cookie? Allah Had no Son? (The latter where th islamics are plotting to ovethrow america by 2010) Boy did you choose a bad example to claim to be free of hate or bigotry. 
I sense this post may be edited. 

Al Kupone
 
  
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  From:  Alternative Religions Guide (JENNIFER417)   7/11/2001 1:30 pm  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (42 of 79)  
 
  48.42 in reply to 48.1  
 
Pharmakeia- 
a poisoner; also a practitioner of medicine. The author of the text you quote is being a little disingenuous in stretching the definition. 

That being said, the modern definition (and practice) of witchcraft bears little resemblance to the biblical one.


Discussions at All religions: 
What was all the fuss about? 
Is big brother watching you?
What is sexual morality? 
Satan, the Beatles, and the secret service... 
A non Christian Narnia?  
  
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Message 43 of 79 was Deleted    



  From:  Al Kupone (Kupone)   7/15/2001 3:57 pm  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (44 of 79)  
 
  48.44 in reply to 48.42  
 
It appears there was another deletion, what this time? Someone saying they disagree with your choice of words? 
Al Kupone
 
  
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  From:  Adrasteia & Lyrk (ToilnTrouble)   7/17/2001 8:33 am  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (45 of 79)  
 
  48.45 in reply to 48.40  
 
Chick.com? LOL! Come on, are you the last Christian to realize no one takes that garbage seriously anymore? The Weekly World News is a better reference source as far as accuracy is concerned.

When in the Hell/Purgatory area, feel free to visit the Den of Iniquity! Join the fun! 
http://forums.delphi.com/firefight/start 

I've got a dragon, and I'm not afraid to use it! 

Adrasteia & Lyrk: 
The Sapphic Spellcasters!
 
  
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  From:  Bridget (callistoluv)   7/22/2001 7:39 pm  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (46 of 79)  
 
  48.46 in reply to 48.1  
 
People are meant to be manipulated by God you mean! 
Your false God of the bible, which is a book of lies, has clouded your mind with foolishness. 
  
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  From:  CLEMMCGANN   8/3/2001 8:40 am  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (47 of 79)  
 
  48.47 in reply to 48.45  
 
David 
If you want an opinion on Chick.com 
why not ask Russ the blood bought 
or better still - 
try posting a link to chick on the 
spirit filled forum 
- - - - 
Clement 
(btw - what has this to do with explaining witchcraft?) 
  
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  From:  David (DavidABrown)    8/3/2001 9:06 am  
To:  CLEMMCGANN   (48 of 79)  
 
  48.48 in reply to 48.47  
 
Hi,

 

I added it because someone made a reference to the Tracks earlier (on another string, in reference to this string).

 

I would like to know what your thoughts are in regard to the Tracks.

 

I take it you disapprove but that is only my assumption.

 

Your posts are very relevant and very well thought out.

 

Please feel free to post any opinions or objections you have. 





David A. Brown
Basic Christian: Forum
 
  
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  From:  CLEMMCGANN   8/3/2001 9:55 am  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (49 of 79)  
 
  48.49 in reply to 48.48  
 
David 
By tracks, I assume that you mean tracts 
- - - 
Let me seek a parallel 
Have you read the Holy Qumran (aka Koran) 
and its argument against the Trinity? 
It starts by defining the Trinity of God the Father, Saint Mary and Jesus. 
Three persons in one Godhead; equal in divinity. 
It continues the definition in a way that most Christians would agree 
Then, God speaks, rebukes and declares I have no need to take a concubine 
The notion of the Trinity is then demolished. 
The line of argument is fine. It is logical. 
Muslims cannot understand how a Christian can hold the Trinity. 
- - - - - 
It is easy for you and I to note that the initial definition of the Trinity is in error. 
However, when a Moslem is engaged in logical argument their minds are directed to the argument and not to the definition, which they, more or less, take for granted. 
Similarly, with Chick, he defines errors he sees in other belief systems, 
and then explains how they are in error. They are trivialised in a trivial way 
- - - - - 
If you know little of these belief systems, then it is easy to enjoy his attacks on them. 
If you are familiar with them then it is the person who bears Chick who (not only) looks foolish 
Witness requires prayer and the Holy Spirit. Without the Spirit, we are powerless. 
- - - - - 
Clement 
- - - - - 
[No offence against Unitarians or oneness Pentecostals or others intended in the illustration] 
 
  
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  From:  Sae Sawanoguchi (ChibiPixxy)   9/6/2001 10:39 am  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (50 of 79)  
 
  48.50 in reply to 48.1  
 
Soooo.....if a Christian tries to convert someone to Christianity against thier will, isn't that manipulation as well? But since it's Christian, it must be ok, right?

  "In this city stained with greed
there is only wind blowing towards the sky
all that is left of trampled love
is the tear left in the palm of my hand
ah, were smiles only meant to sunder?
every one has their wounded hearts"
~~~
"When I close my eyes there is eternity
Whose voice whispers nearby?
Who is the person that touches my cheek?
The mysterious night conceals truth
And shows gloom; the moon invites to
The spreading darkness...."

~~~
"Shojo ga
te o hiite tsurete kuru.
Mo: nannimo irana...i...
Aka to kuro wa anshin no sekai...
Itsuma...demo nemureru no... 
Koko wa eien... nemuri no kuni"

  
   



Click da kitties to e-mail me!

Right now, Sae is feeling:   
  
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  From:  David (DavidABrown)    9/6/2001 2:15 pm  
To:  Sae Sawanoguchi (ChibiPixxy)   (51 of 79)  
 
  48.51 in reply to 48.50  
 
Hi,

 

Actually Christianity is Belief and you cannot force people to believe.

Some mistakenly might have tried to make others a Christian but people do not make other people Christians, Only God by His Spiritual rebirth can make someone a Christian.

 

 

The Bible is clear that people cannot make other People into Christians. People can and Should clearly explain what Christianity is and that Christianity is a Life relationship with God. What some people attempt to do is to force others using the name of Christian to do what they want. i.e. pay money or submit or act a certain way but that is not Christianity. Christianity is a Relationship with God the giver of Life and the creator of the universe.

 

 

John 1:9-13 That  (Jesus) was the True Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world. He (Jesus) was in the world, and the world was made by Him, and the world knew Him not. He came unto His own, and His own received Him not. But as many as received Him, to them gave He the power to become the children of God, even to them that believe on His name:

Which were born (became Christians)not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

 

The Bible is clear that it is not the physical (flesh) birth that makes one a Christian nor is it the blood of humans or animals, nor can other people will or force someone to be a Christian but only by accepting the person and name of God Jesus, then God by His Spirit, gives His Spirit into the human spirit for the Spiritual rebirth into Christianity .

 

As far as Manipulation goes Satan is the manipulator and is trying to manipulate people into his Destructive ways.





David A. Brown
Basic Christian: Forum
 
  
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  From:  Beautiful Sadness (RavenT6)   9/8/2001 9:57 pm  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (52 of 79)  
 
  48.52 in reply to 48.1  
 
Why is Witchcraft evil? We are not Satanist. Most Witches 
don't even believe in Christian concepts such as Hell and Satan. 
So please explain more if you will.


Visit the Veil.
My Crossroad
Ash's Sanctuary
Way of the Goddess 
   
  
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  From:  David (DavidABrown)    9/8/2001 10:29 pm  
To:  Beautiful Sadness (RavenT6)   (53 of 79)  
 
  48.53 in reply to 48.52  
 
Hi,

 

Belief is not the same as Reality!

 

You cannot make up your own Reality system.

 

In the end Reality is Reality and the Truth is Truth, as I stated earlier in this string - to not believe in the existence of God and the destructive nature of Satan is to neglect reality.

 

And yes to neglect Reality is Harmful there are consequences in following a Lie and the consequences include harm, pain, neglect, sin and death. To ignore God Jesus the Only  God who Loves you, created you, gave you life (awareness) and who died for you on the Cross so your sins can be forgiven and you can enter into the presence of God is to be cruel to God.

 

Which craft is evil because it is so harmful, and hurtful, and without Jesus the destruction of witchcraft lasts an eternity.





David A. Brown
Basic Christian: Forum
 
  
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  From:  Beautiful Sadness (RavenT6)   9/8/2001 10:58 pm  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (54 of 79)  
 
  48.54 in reply to 48.53  
 
What if you were raised in the craft? What if one never knew your 
Jesus? Do you believe Christianity and Witchcraft can be mixed? 
Do you have any verses on all of this for me as well? I am a seeker 
and always interested in learning more. I have had an interesting journey so far but, I am kinda stuck on the same questions and always interested in others opinions. Feel free to check out my forums Ravenscrossroads and Beyond the veil. We have many Christians (Whom are my friends) that come there. Such as Kathi who Hosts Exwitch. 
Thank you for replying back to me and may I ask how you became a Christian and if you were ever involved in Witchcraft of any form? 

Blessed be!


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Ash's Sanctuary
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  From:  Sleepless (WASHUQUEBEC)   9/9/2001 7:01 am  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (55 of 79)  
 
  48.55 in reply to 48.53  
 
I have read everything in this tread, and in all of it there is a single thing that bothers me, and you are the one who said it, more then once. Here, let me quote you 
>>Belief is not the same as Reality!<< 

>>In the end Reality is Reality and the Truth is Truth, as I stated earlier in this string - to not believe in the existence of God and the destructive nature of Satan is to neglect reality.<< 

Prove to me that the christian God is reality. See, you are contradicting yourself. Yes, Belief in not the same as reality. But YOUR belief does not define reality either. As you stated, beleif is not reality, then by your own word, then God is not "reality". 

Whatever beleif system you have, you CANNOT prove outside of any doupt that it is the only real one. Why? Because it is a beleif, not a reality. If your only argument that paganisim is evil is that it doesn't fit your reality, I am afraid you are going to hell, according to your own religion. I do belive one of the commendments is to love others, and not to judge, and by your actions, you are not only being judgemental, you are being unloving 




Frank
Aka Mad Chaz 

Proud owner of Mad Chaz's Sites 



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  From:  David (DavidABrown)    9/9/2001 7:50 am  
To:  Sleepless (WASHUQUEBEC)   (56 of 79)  
 
  48.56 in reply to 48.55  
 
Yes,

The Bible is Proven to be True!!

Yes,

God does Exist!!

 

These topics are thoroughly discussed in other Topics on this forum so I will only briefly explain them and you can read the postings on the Dead Sea Scrolls and some of the Atheist debate postings.

 

1)You Exist! Plants, animals, rocks, stars, spirits, angels, demons all exist, And of course the Creator of everything has to Also Exists and that is God. Please dont be so selfish and so self centered to think that you Exist yet God cannot exist because you disagree with Him.

 

2)      The Bible is written Prophetically the Bible is written about Events, Times and Places, before they happen. The Bible is written with More Knowledge than Man Has, any man. Knowledge of Heaven, Hell, Angels, the Beginning, the End, God and Humans are all Thoroughly covered in the Bible.

 

The Bible unlike any other writing thoroughly covers Life and Death and thoroughly covers Reality. God has Revealed Himself and Reality to us in His word the Bible.





David A. Brown
Basic Christian: Forum
 
  
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  From:  David (DavidABrown)    9/9/2001 7:55 am  
To:  Beautiful Sadness (RavenT6)   (57 of 79)  
 
  48.57 in reply to 48.54  
 
Christianity is Jesus All the Way, God does not Mingle Himself with the Demonic.

 

The Bible says it is not possible to serve two Masters and the World is told to Reverence God and Him alone.

 

Im sure some Christians visit your forum and do try to reach out to you and others but they need to speak for themselves.  I dont think it is right for you to come here and say that Kathi or anyone else supports you.  Let Kathi speak for herself and she does have a forum called Exwitch.   Im sure she loves you but I doubt she supports what you do.

 

No I was never in the Occult, I do have a couple of friends that were and are deeply involved in it being born into it.  I can see the hurt, pain, emotion and trauma that fellowship with demons causes.

 

I think the biggest mistakes non-Christians make about us Christians is that we Christians know Sin and suffering, deception, lies, manipulation and pain and we now know the Truth in Jesus and in the Bible.  Christians have seen what the world has to offer and we have Gladly Rejected what the world has. We Christians are not so easily swayed from the Truth of Jesus having also lived in the Lies of this world.

 

I hope that you do choose to Honor God by turning from the Demonic.  In Turing to God you will Experience True Love and True Life in the One True God Jesus.

 





David A. Brown
Basic Christian: Forum
 
  
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  From:  Sleepless (WASHUQUEBEC)   9/9/2001 8:15 am  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (58 of 79)  
 
  48.58 in reply to 48.56  
 
Well, I have not read everything in this forum, but I will tell you this. You claim I am being narrow minded, but I have yet to tell what *I* belive in. What I said was that you have no true proff that God exists, and no mather how hard you try, you never will. You can conjure up all the philosophical debates you like, you will not have proof. All the proof you speak if is very biased. You claim it is the only posible truth, but in reality, the only logical argument that can be made that "A" got exists is that the universe as laws, but that does not mean it is "YOUR" god that is the one it speaks off. 
Please, do not claim others are narrow minded when you refuse to see any evidence that points in another dirrection then the one you are going toward. 


Frank
Aka Mad Chaz 

Proud owner of Mad Chaz's Sites 



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  From:  Sleepless (WASHUQUEBEC)   9/9/2001 8:19 am  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (59 of 79)  
 
  48.59 in reply to 48.57  
 
>>We Christians are not so easily swayed from the Truth of Jesus having also lived in the Lies of this world.<< 
I'm sorry, but that sentence very much sounds like what a cult master would tell his followers. Someone earlier refered to you as a fundi (person who is so stuck up in his belief he refuses to see that anyone else might be right), and I think that if this is what you belive, you are not only a fundi, but an idiot. Christianity was born in persecution, so if you claim christians do not know sin, suffering and pain, you are in contradiction with your roots. Not to mention that Jesus himself said that anyone who had not commited a sin should throw the first stone at the poor woman, but did you ever notice, Jesus did not throw a stone?


Frank
Aka Mad Chaz 

Proud owner of Mad Chaz's Sites 



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   From:  David (DavidABrown)    9/9/2001 5:00 pm  
To:  Sleepless (WASHUQUEBEC)   (60 of 79)  
 
  48.60 in reply to 48.59  
 
You misread my post I said that Christians do know sin, pain, and suffering.. therefore your Juvenal Tantrum is misdirected and misplaced.

 

As far a Jesus Casting the first stone He Did! One of the Names of Jesus is Rock or Stone and Jesus (Rock) Instructed (Caste a Rock solid Truth) to the Lady to go and Sin No More.

 

Stoning is the Biblical Punishment for sinning. Humans are born with the sin nature that we have inherited going all the way back to the Original sin of Adam and Eve. While we are in our current physical bodies it is not possible for us to cease entirely from sinning. The only way to stop sinning is to die. This is where being stoned to death comes in the remedy for a sinner is to stone them to death and then they are no longer capable of continuing in sin. This is the Picture of a Christian a Christian Has Died to Self and to this World, died to the sins of this world to now Live with Jesus. This is Acted out in the Water Christian Baptism. Baptism is the Burial (dead to sin) in water and the Resurrection (Alive to God) Relationship.

 

When Jesus instructed the Lady to Go and Sin no more He was telling Her to Become a Christian to Die to this world and Resurrect (Live) with God. Jesus did cast a Stone, His stones are Spiritual not physical.





David A. Brown
Basic Christian: Forum
 
  
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From:  Beautiful Sadness (RavenT6)   9/9/2001 7:45 pm  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (61 of 79)  
 
  48.61 in reply to 48.57  
 
I never said she did agree w/ me about anything I said those are some of the people who come to my forum. Kathi and I agree to disagree on some issues and she knows I don't need anyone to reach out to me. Some people look at one for their hearts and not their religions. 
A little bird just whispered to me sound familar? That you may just be Russ aka bloodbought so I am out of here. 

See ya!


Visit the Veil.
My Crossroad
Ash's Sanctuary
Way of the Goddess 
  
 
  
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  From:  Beautiful Sadness (RavenT6)   9/9/2001 7:47 pm  
To:  Sleepless (WASHUQUEBEC)   (62 of 79)  
 
  48.62 in reply to 48.58  
 
Cool sig :)


Visit the Veil.
My Crossroad
Ash's Sanctuary
Way of the Goddess 
   
  
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  From:  David (DavidABrown)    9/9/2001 8:07 pm  
To:  Beautiful Sadness (RavenT6)   (63 of 79)  
 
  48.63 in reply to 48.61  
 
It should be evident that my name is David.

You might want to listen to the voice of a different bird (spirit) one that tells the truth.

 





David A. Brown
Basic Christian: Forum
 
  
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  From:  Sleepless (WASHUQUEBEC)   9/10/2001 5:10 pm  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (64 of 79)  
 
  48.64 in reply to 48.60  
 
Well, this is a good laugh :) 
You are pretty much babeling to yourself my friend. Calling me a juvenile doesn't make you any more important. It's easy to see you are not even able to conduct an argument on a mature level. 

You make reference to translations (like saying Jesus means rock or stone), but I would love to see a reliable source for that so called solid truth. 

I have yet to see any refutation of what I said, about you being wrong that just because your "reality" is christianity, it as to be THE (placed for empasis, not screaming) true reality. See, there is a phenomena in cults where the leader will tell his followers the rest of the world is evil, and that HIS view is the truth, so that they will disregard the rest of the world when it tells them how stupid they are being. Sounds familiar?


Frank
Aka Mad Chaz 

Proud owner of Mad Chaz's Sites 



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  From:  Sleepless (WASHUQUEBEC)   9/10/2001 5:11 pm  
To:  Beautiful Sadness (RavenT6) unread  (65 of 79)  
 
  48.65 in reply to 48.62  
 
Thanks :) 
Friend of mine found the image.


Frank
Aka Mad Chaz 

Proud owner of Mad Chaz's Sites 



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  From:  jackduggins   10/2/2001 4:27 am  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (66 of 79)  
 
  48.66 in reply to 48.56  
 
your logic is FALLACY! 
Just bacause things exist, doesn't mean that GOD exists! 

jEEZ!
 
  
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  From:  The Rebecca Review.com (A281NPSIMI1C)   10/18/2001 4:45 am  
To:  Sleepless (WASHUQUEBEC) unread  (67 of 79)  
 
  48.67 in reply to 48.58  
 
How do you love someone who doesn't exist and from where does love come? We love God because he first loved us. When you meet God, it is hard not to fall in love with him. There is a certain "joy" Christians feel and that is one of the ways they know 
they have found truth. 
They learn to love God by reading the words of God. How can I prove 
you are you? I just see your words. ;> Sometimes I think of this place like a collective consiousness. God knows all, we are just beggining to see what he already knows. 

Before I go to your gardner site 
...could you tell me what it is about? 

This place is really fun...I like reading 
both sides of the story. 

Best, 

R. 

 
  
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  From:  The Rebecca Review.com (A281NPSIMI1C)   10/18/2001 4:46 am  
To:  Beautiful Sadness (RavenT6) unread  (68 of 79)  
 
  48.68 in reply to 48.61  
 
I can't see your gifs? Could it be they are not uploaded to a site? I had that problem a while back. 
R. 
 
  
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  From:  The Rebecca Review.com (A281NPSIMI1C)   10/18/2001 4:48 am  
To:  David (DavidABrown)    (69 of 79)  
 
  48.69 in reply to 48.63  
 
You have a really nice forum here David...I am wandering around seeing what you have to offer. Nice topics! I was interested in the whole Harry Potter/Wiccan subject as well. 
R. 
 
  
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  From:  Marxach   10/28/2001 7:38 am  
To:  jackduggins unread  (70 of 79)  
 
  48.70 in reply to 48.66  
 
Dia huit, Duggins. 
I tend to disgree with YOUR logic.
 
  
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  From:  Jhardings   12/24/2001 3:03 pm  
To:  nbreeze   (77 of 79)  
 
  48.77 in reply to 48.76  
 
Hi! 
An original Gutenberg Bible is in German, the "later" printings are Latin text. By "later" I mean like a six month lag time. There is still some argument over which came first. I know because my Grandma just sent the family copy off to be rebound/restored for probably the 6th or so time in its life. Its been in the family forever and I've done a heck of a lot of research on it. Ironically enough, not a heck of a lot is known about the Gutenberg Bible. Not as much as you'd think, anyway.
 
  
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Message 78 of 79 was Deleted    



   From:  Jhardings   12/25/2001 9:37 pm  
To:  nbreeze   (79 of 79)  
 
  48.79 in reply to 48.78  
 
I do hope you're right. Too bad people often address old books just as they do other antiques; They care more about the money they can make off of their garage sale find then they care about where it came from. 
  
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